and on the flipside...  Some of my not-so-bright friends used a couple of cans of ether to get them home cause they ran out of gas.  One driving, the other standing on the front bumper with his arm up under the hood spraying full boar going down the road.  No adverse affects to the engine, in fact its still running around today. 

I have heard the same thing though, that it eats the oil off of cylinder walls and it should never be used in 2 strokes for that reason.  However, farmers, loggers, and anyone else that has a big diesel have been using ether to start their riggs since the beginning of time so it does have some use and obviously doesnt ruin them. 

Good advice though.  If your engine doesnt start without ether, FIX IT!

Yes, used on lots of diesels for years. There's 2 ways to use it: the right way and the wrong way. Wrong way is to spray directly into induction system or down carb throat. The right way is to saturate a rag with ether starting fluid and hold rag over intake or carb throat, the vapors are plenty to start an engine. Gotta be careful though, don't want a hand sucked into a turbo impeller...

What is the best way to use it on an XL?  I'm guesing remove the air filter and stuff the rag losely in the air filter box?  It would be hard too hold it while kicking it over.  Related to my "She won't crank" post, I just want to see if I can get it firing.

Hmmm.....  I'm gonna have to throw the flag on this one.  Urban Legend.

I've used (as have all my family - father & 3 older brothers in the agricultural and roofing fields with dozens of gasoline engines between us) spray start for all my life with no ill effects whatever - 2 strokes and 4, gasoline and diesel.  Sprayed right in the air cleaner, air inlet, carb throat, what have you.

In fact I've got two different brands of el cheapo starting fluid in the garage right now.

From the first:

"Helps start stubborn engines fast in cold weather - Saves batteries - Contains upper cylinder lubricant - Finely dispersed diethyl ether enters the system ready for combustion even at -65 dgreees F.  It is also recommended for use in starting outboard motors, power lawn mowers, chain saws, fractional horsepower engines and passenger cars.
Directions:
1.  Do not use in deisel engines WITH GLOW PLUGS
2.  Do ot flood engine before using.
3.  Spray into carburetor or air intake for short burst.  Do not overuse product.
4.  Start engine in normal manner.  Do not spray while starting.
5.  If engine fails to start, repeat procedure maximum of three more times."

 and from the second:

"Brand X starting fluid helps start gasoline and diesel engines faster even in the coldest conditions.  Combustion ready at -40 degrees F.  Regular use gives fast starts, extends battery life, and saves wear on starters.  For year-round use in cars, trucks, lawn mowers, chain saws, marine engines, tractors and motorcycles.

CAUTION:  DO NOT USE IN DIESEL ENGINES WITH GLOW PLUGS.

DIRECTIONS:  Before attempting to start engine, hold can upright and spray starting fluid for no more than 3 seconds into air intake or carburetor.  Start engine.

DO NOT SPRAY WHILE ATTEMPTING TO START ENGINE.  DO NOT USE PRODUCT TO MOUNT OR SEAL TIRES.  DO NOT LET CAN CONTACT BATTERY TERMINALS OR STARTER SOLENOID."


IMHO, the bit about washing oil off the cylinder walls - that just sounds like a good theory, but it doesn't happen that way in practice.  Naturally, I have no proof, but ether has been used by SOOO many people in SOOOOO many internal combustion applications over the last 5 or 6 decades, that there's virtually no chance that it does any damage whatever.

Boilerman, spray away!  right into the carb!

Good luck,

Kirk

I put the info up to help people protect their investments. What one chooses to do with the info is their business. If you check with several engine manufacturers you'll find that they warn strongly against it, and I believe it voids warranty on Cummins. There's all kinds of things that are inherently dangerous or damaging that some people get away with. Others don't have that good fortune.

The part about washing top cylinder lubricant off of cylinder walls is in no way an urban legend, it's a fact. It is basic chemistry, very basic, combined with very basic mechanics. Some engines may last longer being abused, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea to use it. It can and does cause engine damage, sometimes very quickly. An engine in good mechanical condition with low miles might not show the signs of damage right away, and maybe a guy trades cars off every year or two. Pity the future buyer though!

I'm not suprised that a manufacturer selling the product would endorse it as an excellent and safe product to use. Why not? They make their profits, the heck with you, and little chance to get sued with the cost of mounting a litigation against a manufacturer.

I stand firmly on what I posted in the first 2 posts, that spraying ether starting fluid in the intake directly from the can will cause damage to an engine, period.

If an engine will not start there is a mechanical, electrical or fuel problem, not an ether problem. If your or your family's experience is using it often to start engines then my conclusion is your engines often are in need of some kind of repair? An engine in good mechanical condition with all systems in order never needs ether starting fluid. An engine in bad condition or with components out of adjustment or out of tune will not be fixed by adding ether. Therefore I fail to see a use for it. I do drive a diesel, have for years, and never 'needed' ether yet, have never needed it on any other engine, and never will. I keep everything in tune or fix what's broken.

Regarding stuffing an ether soaked rag in the airbox, no, not the answer. If using it at all the idea is to soak a rag with it and hold the rag close to primary air intake. Ether is extremely volatile and vaporizes at low temperature/pressure so just the vapors escaping from rag near intake are enough to start an engine.

As mentioned in the previous post: if you can't start the engine without ether then the engine needs mechanical, electrical or fuel system repairs. Not hard to figure out what it needs, most manuals walk you through troubleshooting. So, do your engine a favor and troubleshoot the problem because ether can't fix anything, and could do major damage!

If you have problems with the engine post here and maybe someone can help you find the source of the problem and get you running right.

By the way, Kirk, not wanting to sound hostile at all. Just sharing what I've learned and I'm convinced of the truth of it.

I'm not arguing that the use of starting fluid is a valid alternative to a properly tuned / conditioned engine.  I agree that under normal circumstances starting fluid is not and should not be necessary.

I'm arguing the "sky-is-falling" position that starting fluid WILL damage your engine if used as properly described.  It won't.  Now, obviously, I'm not arguing that if some Cletus goes and sprays ether into a motor for 10 solid seconds that some harm may not result.

But, to troubleshoot or to help start a gimpy motor, a few quick Psst, Psst shots WILL NOT damage the motor.

Caterpillar makes an ether injection kit that can be installed on their large off-road equipment for just such cold-weather starting assistance.  Right from the OEM, on $300,000 pieces of equipment.

OEMs warn against it?  Sure, because most all modern on-road diesels include glow plugs and/or air intake heaters, and you can imagine the consequenses if Cletus goes and sprays ether onto glowing hot glow plugs or intake heater grids.  NOT because the ether will wash the oil off the cylinder walls.

But, I can't argue against someone who just says "better safe than sorry".  There's no way to convince someone who pulls that trump card, because, of course, the more conservative course (ie, never use the product) is always the more defendable course, ie, it's the only way to ensure zero uncertainty. 

I DO find it interesting that, while you describe dire consequences from the use of ether, you then proceed to describe the proper way to use it in a very restrictive, tightly controlled method (the saturated rag waved near the intake).  I mean, is it thus OK to use ether as a starting aid, as long as you take care to only use it sparingly?  Or is it not OK to use at all, because it can simulate thousands of miles of wear, just from even one use, as you state?

Sigh.

Why would anyone use ether to mount a tire? I use it on my lawn mower at the begining of the season cause I am to lazy to drain the fuel and it dosnt like to start with the old gas but it only needs it once a year.

"I DO find it interesting that, while you describe dire consequences from the use of ether, you then proceed to describe the proper way to use it in a very restrictive, tightly controlled method (the saturated rag waved near the intake).  I mean, is it thus OK to use ether as a starting aid, as long as you take care to only use it sparingly?  Or is it not OK to use at all, because it can simulate thousands of miles of wear, just from even one use, as you state?

Sigh."

Seems like you got a real burr in your saddle on this, Kirk!?? From the above you're apparently saying that you can't tell the difference in application of starting fluid in liquid form from application in vapor form?

If you spray starting fluid directly into a carburetor throat, especially on a motorcycle with a very short induction tract, the liquid ether can easily flush through the open intake valve and wash top cylinder lubricant off of cylinder walls. I would guess you have some knowledge of the importance of top cylinder lubricant, it being the primary reason that pistons have oil control rings. As I already explained, the ether can wash off that protective oil coating and cause the engine to start with a bone-dry cylinder until oil pressure pumps and whatever spray system works long enough to re-lubricate cylinder. That's potentially devastating to an engine, especially when done repeatedly.

If you soak a rag and hold rag to intake, not using a stream of liquid ether straight out of the can or nozzle, then it's vapor induction, far different. Very few people seem to use the moistened rag method [except diesel old timers], preferring to spray directly out of can into intake tract. Liquid ether washes top cylinder lubricant off of the cylinder walls, but I doubt that ether vapors do any great harm.

I was correcting my first post to include more accurate information, including the proper way to use it if you must. I have never needed to use the stuff in 40+ years of automotive & mechnical work. I find the starting problem instead.

I'll say it again: I posted the warning as a warning, each may of course suit themselves. Next time you have an engine apart coat the cylinder with oil, even far heavier than the light coating left by oil control rings. Take your handy can of ether and shoot the spray directly at that cylinder, the same as would happen if sprayed directly into carb throat while intake valve is open. See how much oil is left on that cylinder after the chemical pressure washing. I realize that you may still choose to disagree even after that experiment, and again, that's your business.

I was trying to save folk's engines, not make enemies! Do as you like, folks, do as you like!

XL

No, no burr under the saddle.  Just a hair up my *** that day, I guess.  I apologize for the rant.  You're right of course about it being an effective de-greaser.  It'll wash the oil / grease right off stuff.  Again, I apologize for the rant.


As for using it to seat a tire, it's funny you mention that, because I overheard a conversation about it just a few weeks ago.  It was a conversation about trying to seat a large truck tire to its rim after replacement.  I'm talking about an industrial dump truck type tire (ie tractor-trailer tire).  Apparently gent one was having trouble getting the tire to seat by the usual method of a sudden blast of air from the compressor.  Gent two mentioned  spraying ether into the tire and somehow igniting it.  The sudden POOF (because ether is so combustible) would be enough to expand the tire and let it seat to the rim.  Thus gent one would be able to finish the inflating using his compressor.

It was the first time I'd ever heard of someone trying that.  

I'll pass on that one.  I LIKE my eyebrows, thank you very much...  :)


 

lol that is very funny I wonder how many people have done that I guess quite a few if they warn against it on the bottle.

Hey, Kirk, my apologies too if I offended. Sometimes words don't come out reading the same as I'm thinking when I'm writing. Sorry for my words that were on the smartass side...

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hey... ummm preferrably try no to use the "starter fluid on the rag" method, because if the engine decides to backfire...........